Tell us about your background and how you were first introduced to the lymphatic system? What led you down this path of healing and bodywork?
I was introduced to lymphatic drainage when I was in massage school in the early 90’s in Marin County. I fell in love with the subtle, gentle nature of the work. It was unlike any of my other classes, which mainly focused on deep tissue muscle work. The specificity of lymphatic strokes are grounded in science and physiology. They are lighter due to the delicate nature of the lymphatic vasculature whose systemic nature is to transport and purify excess waste that accumulates in the tissues. Once I learned that lymphatic massage can be helpful for people who've gone through cancer treatment I knew I found my life’s calling, I lost my mother to cancer when I was just 13 years old and I saw the toll that side effects from treatments took on my mother’s body. Lymphatic massage benefits include aiding in detoxification, strengthening the immune system, reduction of inflammation and increased vitality.
We’ve read that your work is a “moving meditation”. Can you explain what this means?
When I was in massage school in the early 90’s my lymphatic massage teacher taught us Tai Chi and Qi Gong. She taught us that movement was not only an essential way for practitioners to feel relaxed in our bodies, but it sets the tone to cultivate a sacred space for our clients. The rhythm and cadence of lymph flow mimics the slow, gentle movements of Tai Chi. It reminds me of the way seaweed undulates in the ocean; an image I talk about constantly because it’s a reminder when lymph flows everything else flows too.
What do you think are the key components of healing?
The ability to connect with yourself, listen to your body, respect the needs of your physical and emotional body and to seek joy. Our bodies are constantly sending us messages. Learn to trust your intuition, whether it’s finding the right doctor, eating plan or exercise regimen. Take a good look at what is causing you stress and how you handle it. When we can trust what we need throughout our lives we give ourselves permission to seek health and self-love. Allowing ourselves to feel these is essential to well-being. One of the things I love about lymph massage is that its gentleness requires you to slow down and you instantly drop into that meditative aspect of the work which can help you access the parasympathetic, rest & digest state of your nervous system where healing occurs. Because the lymphatic system is connected to every other bodily system, when you improve the function of the lymph system the rest of your body will function more optimally.
What is the lymphatic system and why is it so important to our wellbeing?
Your lymphatic system plays a pivotal role in your immune health. Lymph contains excess fluid made up of cellular waste and white blood cells that protect you from viruses and bacteria in your body. Lymph runs like rivers throughout your body similar to your blood vessels. The job of your lymphatic system all day long is to circulate lymph fluid into lymph nodes where white blood cells provide the first line of defense against disease and help to regulate your fluid balance.
Unlike the blood, your lymphatic system doesn’t have a central pump to move it like the way the heart pumps your cardiovascular system. Instead, lymph relies on small, smooth muscle contractions, deep breathing and pumping of nearby arteries to move fluid to areas in your body where you have lymph nodes; mostly clustered in your neck, armpits, sternum, abdomen, the top of your thighs, behind your knees and in your elbow creases. The lymphatic circulation drains out impurities in the fluid space surrounding your tissues (referred to as the interstitial fluid) and transports white blood cells along with bacteria and viruses to lymph nodes where macrophages and lymphocytes do their important job of mounting an immune response to harmful invaders so the fluid can return to the bloodstream once it’s been purified. You also have lymph vessels in your gut that absorb fat, and transports it back to the circulatory system as fuel. I refer to the lymph system as The Great Recycling System due to its systemic cleansing nature.
Because your lymph system doesn’t have a central pump to move it, it needs you to encourage the release of daily toxins. You can stimulate lymph flow with deep diaphragmatic breathing, exercise and dry-brushing, but you can also do lymphatic self-massage which will stimulate your lymph circulation even more specifically.
Where does food tie into lymphatic health?
It’s a huge part of what can make your lymph system run more efficiently or make it congested. Think of it like putting oil in your car. When you put fresh oil in your tank your vehicle runs more smoothly, more cleanly. Over time the filters in your car have a harder time processing all the dirty oil that accumulates and can clog up your engine. When you eat junk food or greasy and processed food it increases what we call the “lymph load” of your body (AKA the metabolic waste) and creates more of a toll on your lymph system. Conversely, when you eat healthy foods and anti-inflammatory herbs you keep your system running more efficiently because there’s less waste the lymph system has to clear up. You can really maximize the benefits of lymph massage through a good diet, hydration and exercise, these are major pillars of lymphatic health.
We love how you often speak about the importance of using clean skincare. Why is this important?
A majority of what we put on our body gets absorbed by the skin. Those excess toxins have to get filtered out through the lymph system. The US allows hundreds of chemicals into our skin care products that are banned in Europe. You don’t want to overburden the lymphatic load with unnecessary toxins. I always encourage people to read the labels of their skincare products and opt for clean ingredients. Also, ditch the deodorant! Your armpits are where your auxilliary lymph nodes are located and their job is to filter lymph fluid from your upper torso and a majority of your breast tissue. Rather than putting chemicals directly in your pits, skip it altogether. Sweating is beneficial for your body, you don't want to inhibit that process (unless of course you have a hot date or an important presentation!)
What tips do you have for taking care of your lymphatic system?
So many! I’m excited to share with you that I’ve written a book about it! It’s titled, The Book of Lymph; Self-Care Practices to Enhance Immunity, Health and Beauty. It will be in stores this May and you can pre-order a copy now. In it I share easy tips on how to achieve lymphatic health including self-massage sequences I developed for headaches, earaches, digestive issues, glowing skin and more. Not only is it a wonderful addition to your holistic library, but it makes a great gift for your wellness-obsessed loved one.
We share a mutual love for the ritual of dry brushing. Can you share some of its benefits and why you love it?
It’s one of the most affordable ways to stimulate lymph flow and digestion, increase blood circulation, and remove dead skin. Dry-brushing will help you feel energized, flush toxins and even improve the appearance of cellulite. That’s a lot of benefits for a reasonably priced tool!
Also, we often get questions on what the right way to dry brush is. Can you share your expert tips?
The basic principle is to brush from your extremities towards your heart, which is ultimately where lymph fluid goes. But I like to massage my lymph nodes first and direct the dry brush to the lymph nodes that correspond with the territory it drains. Your lymph nodes are where waste is purified so I utilize the same principles of dry-brushing as I do self-massage. Direct fluid from your legs to the tops of your thigh (where your inguinal nodes are located). Massage your abdomen clockwise towards your left hip (that’s the direction of your colon for elimination) brush from your right arm and breast to your right armpit, from your left arm and breast to your left armpit (your axillary lymph nodes are located in your armpits) and bring the fluid from the back of your body to the front of your body. Since lymph empties into the venous system you can always simplify by brushing towards your heart. Obviously I am very specific in the way I work but you shouldn’t be intimidated! Just give it a try!
Do you feel that many health problems can be helped by addressing the lymphatic system?
YES! I’ve dedicated my life to this work and the results are astonishing. Whether I work on someone, teach a class or an individual how to do lymphatic self-massage they see the benefits right away and the lasting results. Over the past two and a half decades I’ve worked with people who suffer from ailments ranging from chronic headaches to cancer, lupus, Lyme, IBS, Crohn’s, auto-immune disorders, eczema, lymphedema, digestive problems, menstrual issues, and those who feel sluggish, lethargic and can’t quite pinpoint why they don’t feel great, but once they start lymphatic massage they wonder why no one told them about it sooner.
We see and hear many people talking about the lymphatic system these days, do you see more interest in the lymph recently?
YES! And it makes me so happy! I’ve only been waiting for 27 years for lymphatic health to hit the mainstream wellness world and I'm delighted it’s finally having its golden moment in the sun. Many people are coming to lymph massage now because they hear about the aesthetic results including glowing skin, flatter stomachs and thinner thighs. But the medical establishment has been recommending lymphatic drainage for decades, including pre & post-operatively, and for athletic injuries. It reminds me of the yoga craze; people came to it to have a better body but they stayed because it makes them feel great too. Lymph massage is just like that. YOU CAN HAVE IT ALL! Health, beauty and a strengthened immune system.
Are there foods that are particularly beneficial to lymphatic health?
Purple staining foods are great for microcirculation in the body, including blood and lymph flow. Organic fruits and veggies high in Vitamin C are great for your immune system. Supplements like probiotics, digestive enzymes and bitters help with your gut. The lymphatic system in your gut makes up 70% of your immune system; it’s your first line of defense against food borne illness and helps absorb excess fat in your gut. It’s essential to drink plenty of water too, your lymph system moves with hydration. Stay away from foods that take a toll on the transportation routes of lymph including alcohol, salt, refined sugar, processed foods, snack foods and for some people that can include some dairy products and gluten.
If someone is just becoming acquainted with their lymphatic system, where would you tell them to start? Beginning with reading and also practices?
Obviously I recommend ordering a copy of my book, The Book of Lymph. It’s a first-of-its-kind guide accessible to the lay reader, and for those looking for a more in depth understanding of why lymph is so essential to health. My goal is for you develop a beneficial relationship with your lymph system with easy, affordable methods so you can look and feel your best. I also post free tutorials on my Instagram and I have a video series coming soon.
What other practices do you have that keep you feeling vibrant?
I love swimming in the ocean, hiking in the mountains, dancing and am a big fan of Peloton. So many people don’t talk about it enough, but sex is also key to vitality!
What are your top products from CAP?
Dry Brushes, ALL OF THEM!
Josh Rosebrook Cacao Antioxidant Mask
CAP Beauty CAPtivator Love Bath
High Vibrational Beauty Book
